5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram – The Iconoclast

I recently became interested in Enneagram after attending an MBTI meeting with INFJs and finding out that I have enneagram 5w4. Among this personality system, 5w4 enneagrm is rare similar

5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram - The Iconoclast 5w4-Enneagram-Type-5-Enneagram-5w4-INFJ-Enneagram-The-Iconoclast-Types-300x219 INFJ & MBTI Popular Posts to how rare INFJ types are in MBTI. In this post I want to discuss the INFJ enneagram and how Type 5 Enneagram relates to INFJs.

After reading about it for  some time I have come to the conclusion that MBTI is brain functioning and Enneagram is about morals and values in life. In combination they can describe a person good and compliment each other well.

There also seems to be a correlation between MBTI types and Enneagram types to a certain degree. Here is some interesting reading concerning this subject:

Enneagram Type Test On-Line Stats:

Table of Enneagram Marriage Frequencies:

Enneagram Type and MBTI Type Compared (Statistics):

This is a great book explaining everything you need to know about Enneagram, highly recommended:
5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram - The Iconoclast ir?t=inra09-20&l=as2&o=1&a=0553378201 INFJ & MBTI Popular Posts The Wisdom of the Enneagram: The Complete Guide to Psychological and Spiritual Growth for the Nine Personality Types5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram - The Iconoclast ir?t=inra09-20&l=as2&o=1&a=0553378201 INFJ & MBTI Popular Posts


I’ve also done a bunch of Enneagram tests myself and recently bought the Riso-Hudson Enneagram Type Indicator test which is a scientifically validated test for testing your Enneagram type. You can find it here: http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/

My results concerning my own Enneagram type is that I’m a 5w4. Here is some information about the 5w4 type that I’ve copied:

5w4 – The Five with a Four-Wing: “The Iconoclast”


The traits of the Five and those of the Four reinforce each other in many ways. Both Five and Four are withdrawn types: they turn to the inner world of their imagination to defend their egos and to reinforce their sense of self.

They both feel that something essential in themselves must be found before they can live their lives completely. Fives lack the confidence to act, and Fours lack a strong, stable sense of identity. Thus, Fives with a Four-wing have difficulty connecting with others and staying grounded.

People of this subtype are more emotional and introverted than Fives with a Six-wing, althrough paradoxically, they tend to be more sociable than the other subtype. As a result of their Four component, they are also more interested in the personal and intrapsychic.

The two types also have some significant differences in their approach. Fives are cerebral, holding experience at arm’s length, while Fours internalize everything to intensify their feelings.

Despite these differences–or because of them–these two personality types make one of the richest subtypes, combining possibilities for outstanding artistic as well as intellectual achievement.

5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram - The Iconoclast Albert_Einstein_Head-230x300 INFJ & MBTI Popular Posts Notewothy examples of  5w4 Enneagram subtype include:
Albert Einstein, Werner Heisenburg, Friedrich Nietzsche, Georgia O’Keeffe, John Cage, John Lennon, k. d. lang, Laurie Anderson, James Joyce, Emily Dickinson, Stanley Kubrick, David Lynch, Buster Keaton, Gary Larson, Stephen King, Tim Burton, Clive Barker, Franz Kafka, Umberto Eco, Jean-Paul Sartre, Oriana Fallaci, Glenn Gould, Peter Serkin, Hannah Arendt, Kurt Cobain, and Vincent van Gogh.

In healthy people of Enneagram 5w4 subtype:

We find the union of intuition and knowledge, sensitivity and insight, aesthetic appreciation and intellectual endowments.

Fives with a Four-wing are likely to be involved in the arts as writers, directors, designers, musicians, composers, choreographers, and so forth. The subtype has been somewhat overlooked in many descriptions of Fives because they do not fit the stereotype of the academic/scientific Five (the Five with a Six-wing).

This subtype is more synthetic in its thinking, pulling things together and seeking out new ways of looking at things, Also, Fives with a Four-wing tend to utilize their imaginations more than the analytic, systematic parts of the mind which are more the domain of the other subtype.

If they are involved in science, Fives with a Four-wing are drawn to those areas in which there is less emphasis on experimentation and data collection than on intuition and comprehensive vision.

This subtype is particularly aware of–and on the lookout for–the beauty in a mathematical formula, for example. For this subtype, beauty is one of the indications of truth, because the order which beauty represents is a confirmation of the objective rightness of an idea.

One of the foremost strengths of healthy Fives with a Four-wing lies precisely in their intuition, since intuition helps them uncover areas of knowledge where their conscious thoughts have not yet ventured. The

Four-wing adds a desire to find a unique, personal vision to the curiosity and perceptiveness of the Five, and the result is a propensity to “tinker” with familiar forms until they become something almost unrecognizable.

In talented Fives with a Four-wing this can lead to startling innovations in their chosen fields of endeavor.

In Average Fives with a Four-wing, Enneagram 5w4:

The Four-wing adds emotional depth, but causes difficulties in sustaining efforts and in working with others. Fives with a Four-wing are more independent than Fives with a Six-wing and resist having structures and deadlines imposed on them.

There can be an off-putting detachment from the environment, both because they are involved in their thoughts and because they are introverted and emotionally self-absorbed.

Analytic powers may be used to keep people at arm’s length rather than to understand them more deeply. Emotionally delicate, people of this subtype can be moody and hypersensitive to criticism, particularly regarding the value of their work or ideas, since this impinges directly upon self-esteem.

Both component types tend to withdraw from people and be reclusive. They can be highly creative and imaginative, envisioning alternate realities in great detail, but can get lost in their own cerebral landscapes.

The Four-wing gives a propensity to fantasizing, but with the Five with the Four-wing, the subject matter tends toward the surreal and fantastic rather than the romantic. Individuals of this subtype can become highly impractical, spending most of their time reading, playing intellectual games, or specializing in trivia.

There is often an attraction to dark, forbidden subject matter or to any way of self-expression which would disturb or upset others. Some Fives with a Four-wing become fascinated with the macabre and the horrific.

As they become more impractical and fearful about their possibilities in life, one typical solution is to find emotional solace in various forms of self-indulgence–in alcohol, drugs, or sexual escapades.

Unhealthy persons of 5w4 Enneagram subtype:

May fall prey to debilitating depressions yet be disturbed by aggressive impulses. Envy of others mixes with contempt for them; the desire to isolate the self from the world mixes with regret that it must be so.

Intellectual conflicts make their emotional lives seem hopeless, while their emotional conflicts make intellectual work difficult to sustain. Moreover, if this subtype becomes neurotic, it is one of the most alienated of all of the personality types: profoundly hopeless, nihilistic, self-inhibiting, isolated from others, and full of self-hatred.

Unhealthy Fives with a Four-wing retreat into a very bleak, minimal existence, attempting to cut off from all needs. The self-rejection and dispair of the Four combines with the cynical nihilism of the Five to create a worldview that is relentlessly negative and terrifying. Social isolation, addiction, and chronic depression are common. Suicide is a real possibility.


I can relate to a lot of this and have definitely experienced the unhealthy aspect of it. I’m very introverted and intuitive, the intuitive aspect of my personality brings me my HSP sensitivities and introversion amplifies them.

I tend to have to withdraw often to recharge and struggle to keep control of my feelings. I’m detached from reality and experience feelings of disembodied from reality on a daily basis, I think this is what feeds my need to use my Se function since it grounds me in reality.

I’m predominately a feeler in my values and morals but I’m stuck in my mind thinking all the time. Interested in science, psychology, technology, paranormal subjects and tend to lean towards the mystical instead of rational.

I like to investigate and understand the world around me and as a child I used to break things apart and put them back together again to understand how they worked. Always had a big imagination and love the arts. I studied programming growing up and was good at it but ended up working
with digital arts and media because I enjoy that even more.
Probably because it also feeds my inferior function Se as an INFJ, for both good and worse. When I’m stressed I can be very self indulgent and neurotic, isolating myself from the world both in my mind and externally.

Here are some results from cognitive tests I’ve done recently, I feel that I di
ffer somewhat from other INFJs and in some aspects are similar to INFPs. But as you can se my Si inferior is very poorly developed as INFJs/INTJs. If anybody else can relate to any of this please feel free to comment!

5w4 Enneagram, INFJ Type 5 Enneagram - The Iconoclast 5w4-Enneagram-Type-5-Enneagram-5w4-INFJ-Enneagram-The-Iconoclast-introvert-297x300 INFJ & MBTI Popular Posts

Cognitive Process
Level of Development (Preference, Skill and Frequency of Use)
extraverted Sensing (Se)
*******************  (19.3)
limited use
introverted Sensing (Si)
**********  (10.2)
extraverted Intuiting (Ne)
**************************************  (38.5)
excellent use
introverted Intuiting (Ni)
***************************************  (39.6)
excellent use
extraverted Thinking (Te)
*********************************  (33.5)
good use
introverted Thinking (Ti)
*****************************  (29.6)
average use
extraverted Feeling (Fe)
*************************************  (37.3)
excellent use
introverted Feeling (Fi)
********************************  (32.2)
good use
Your Cognitive Functions:
Introverted Intuition (Ni) |||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.29
Extroverted Intuition (Ne) ||||||||||||||||||||||| 10.58
Extroverted Feeling (Fe) |||||||||||||||||| 8.07
Introverted Feeling (Fi) ||||||||||||| 5.85
Extroverted Thinking (Te) ||||||| 2.93
Introverted Thinking (Ti) ||| 0.69
Extroverted Sensation (Se) || -2.2
Introverted Sensation (Si) |||| -3.23
Your Extroverted Intuition (Ne) is very developed.
Your Introverted Intuition (Ni) is very developed.
Your Introverted Thinking (Ti) is moderate.
Your Extroverted Thinking (Te) is moderate.
Your Extroverted Feeling (Fe) is moderate.
Your Introverted Feeling (Fi) is moderate.
Your Extroverted Sensation (Se) is low.
Your Introverted Sensation (Si) is low.
Humanmetrics Jung Typology Test™
Your Type INFJ
Introvert(78%)  iNtuitive(100%)  Feeling(88%)  Judging(33%)
  • You have strong preference of Introversion over Extraversion (78%)
  • You have strong preference of Intuition over Sensing (100%)
  • You have strong preference of Feeling over Thinking (88%)
  • You have moderate preference of Judging over Perceiving (33%)


  1. Ashar says

    While reading this post, I constantly felt violated. The real way to understand yourself is definitely by combining your MBTI type with your enneagram. Before that I tried to fit in with INTJs INTPs and INFPs but something always felt amiss.

    Thank you for this post. Now I know for sure I’m not weird and despite being from the least minority of population, I’m definitely not the only one.

  2. Kath says

    I’m an INFJ that works in Analytics. Depending on the MTBI test I take, I’m often considered as an INTJ. However, I’m not confident and direct enough to be an INTJ. People around me thinks I’m extra sensitive but people that doesn’t know me well or see me in my work environment thinks I’m an INTJ. I care for people way too much and I understand them easily. I’m seen as social but an hermit at the same type. It’s a strange feeling to love people so much but to love being alone even more. When I see people, I get drained and I have anxiety attacks. I saw a therapist for agoraphobia, lol. But I make friends super easily. I just never call them.

    As a kid, I was always playing alone and asking my parents to tell my friends I wasn’t home. However, I had a lot of friend. I had good grades in math and literature. Always felt like I loved writing more but since I had very good grades in math, everyone was pushing me in another direction because I could make more money. Now, I wish I was an engineer, lol.

    My brain is constantly running. I love strategy, concept, puzzle and logic. I just know that deep down I’m a softy. I love psychology a lot. I buy academic books even if I’m not in the field. I also love to understand serial killers and deeply wounded people, however, my softy side is so afraid of everything dark that I often cry or get insomnia after watching tv shows, lol!

    Before finding that I’m also an 5w4 I always felt like my heart was an INFJ but my mind an INTJ. Now I get it! Well, partially. Thanks for sharing.

    Would love to connect!

    • LJ says

      Hello I liked your descriptions of life and appreciate for humans but strong preference for being alone. Same here. I always test INTJ but I actually dislike maths and have hang ups about numbers. I can do it but it feels like hard work. Whereas language, literature and psychology/psychiatry are super compelling. I also strongly dislike people arguing and conflict and yet INTJs seems to not be bothered by that. Bizarrely I’m an a lawyer specialising in litigation and appear in court a lot. But in that context disputes are okay. Though I am very, very good at mediation. I identify strongly when I read about INFJ but also aspects of INTJ. When I read about and tested over and over as an enneagram 5w4 that made sense. That fits me 100% and I think I’m INFJ but I actually have learnt not to care too much either way. What I’ve learned about Myers Briggs and the enneagram has helped me a lot. No one who knows me would believe what an introvert I am. I’m glad you have friends. I actually don’t really think I have proper friends at all to be brutally honest though I don’t appear that way. Sometimes I worry about it but when I think about it I can’t identify anyone I’d actually want to contact. Maybe you should become an engineer? I’d like to have been a psychiatrist but there was the maths issues.

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  7. John Locke says

    This is a very insightful article for a fictional character I’ve been writing in a story. Note that I am not an INFJ myself (I am an INTJ and have not yet tested my enneagram). However, I’ve been trying to figure out the personality type of a character I’ve written in a story. She is the most psychologically complicated character I’ve ever created. But she is also one member of an ensemble, so I tend to balance focus between many different characters. So how much I can explore her psyche in the writing depends on the confines of the narrative structure.

    I vaguely intuited that my character seemed INFJ, yet she has unique values and a dynamic arc that made it hard for me to be sure, I wondered if she might be INTJ like myself instead. But I tend to think of her as being sensitive to the external feelings and values of her environment and even drawing on those for inspiration in her ideas, and she seems less interested in managing the environment in a strictly practical and technical way. Though during certain times in her life she has been more withdrawn and dismissive of people and more preoccupied with technical interests as well as her own passions. But she also felt an increasingly overwhelming guilt and conflict for doing so, to the extent that she split into two personalities, one who took on her more conscientious side and one who took on her more ambitious side.

    So finally I took an enneagram test for her and determined she was 5w4, although the website locked me from being able to learn a lot about this personality without paying. So I then did a search for 5w4 INFJ’s, and I came to this article.

    Some things you wrote resonate with some features of her story. Like the mixed interest in analytical fields such as science and paranormal though with a somewhat mystical bent, or the childhood interest in imaginatively putting things together, or the feeling of being detached and disembodied from reality at times. (Though in the case of my character’s story, she actually does become more detached and disembodied in a physical sense due to the otherworldly direction her journey takes…)

    My character has a dynamic blend of attitudes and she has changed over the course of her arc. She has an interest in trying to synthesize both the spiritual and the mechanical, trying to bring machines to life by imbuing them with spirit from her studies of the paranormal, though later on rejecting this pursuit consequences. At times depending on what point she is in her life, her outlook has ranged from being more spiritual or more technical, more optimistic or more pessimistic, more people-concerned or more work-concerned, more moralistic or more ambitious, more confident or more guilt-ridden, more isolated or more involved.

    Anyway, thanks for the article, it was interesting to read! And I think it gives me more favor to my initial intuition that the character I’ve written is an INFJ. Though I still can’t say for sure, especially due to the psychological damage and supernatural experience her mind has undergone. It’s possible her cognitive structure was even shifted into a different personality type altogether.

    • John Locke says

      I apparently didn’t finish refining a certain sentence of this comment, so I wanted to complete it:

      >She has an interest in trying to synthesize both the spiritual and the mechanical, trying to bring machines to life by imbuing them with spirit from her studies of the paranormal, though later on rejecting this pursuit consequences.<

      The last bit of that should say that she rejected the pursuit due to more spiritual concerns for spiritual consequences of it.

      I had originally written a complete sentence there, but I started to adjust it and forgot to finish it. You know how Ni can overlook the little details!

  8. says

    This was good because I’m a 5w4 and my husband is a 5w6 and the differences you discussed are accurate, especially the social aspect, because I might have more friends (not by much, lol) and more easily get deeper relationships, he has a much easier time interacting with people in public. He’s a LOT less awkward and more social when we are out with people.

  9. tammy says

    I am an average INFJ 5w4 HSP who recently spent 4 years being trapped in a situation that left me an unhealthy INFJ 5s4 HSP. Very debilitating over time. I couldn’t even perceived how bad off I was until the stress caused my brain to shut my body down. My blood pressure had gotten so high it was up to 170 and I only weigh 130 lbs. I was experiencing panic attacks which I didn’t recognize for what they were when they started because I had never had them before. Thankfully, I was able to get out right when the pandemic quarantine was in place in April 2020. Now it is just trying to comeback to average in an unknown future. I take solace in the fact that in the past 6 months I know what to expect for the next 12 months. Although that isn’t good, it gives me some footing.

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  13. Anonymous says

    This post man. Wow. Well thank you for helping me confirm I’m pretty damn sure I’m a 5w4. I’m an INFJ and finally decided to get into the whole thing that is the enneagram. I just took a few simpler tests of it that were free online but was pretty sure I was a 5 bc it resonated with my most innate state of being, especially throughout my entire childhood. Didn’t know yet exactly my wing was most likely 4 until I took a test from a second site that put me as most likely being a 5w4. Once I found this post it was all the confirmation I needed. This is pretty much me, except I’m a bit different in regards to interests I guess. I was always good at math and took pre-calc in eighth grade & stuff but knew I didn’t want to be an engineer or anything ever, little desire for calc. I’m not a fan of taking on science myself, am not so interested in studying psychology as a subject since certain situations can be annoyingly emphasized upon and I don’t see why it’s that fascinating- you’re just studying human tendencies and how their minds can differ (been doing some of that since birth).
    At this point I’m choosing to study within the realm of accounting and whatnot. Not the most visually stimulating, but I’m not particularly interested in the arts because I myself prefer a set routine. I’m good at writing, but I don’t have the mind to write more than one book or so if I ever do. I can draw if I try, but it isn’t a hobby. Hopefully I don’t end up in digital arts & media bc though I did take marketing in high school and PS/illustrator was fun, the career circumstances for the arts isn’t something I want. Genuinely, I’m not talented enough to feel like it’s a calling for me. I’m sticking to this for now, maybe one day I can get a bit more creative with the field I’m going for right now.
    Also– I don’t understand how alcohol/sexcapades are what so many people in this world fall to. Maybe I’m just that detached from the physical or my ideals are that high but it’s sad to me that they end up going that route when you’re essentially destroying your body. Well, maybe that might come with the self hatred. I’ve never been able to hate myself much. I observed the world, understood the dynamics, and came to terms that things would get better when I got older because of the fundamental ignorance most adults display about children. I didn’t bother blaming myself because things eventually come to terms and I was just there riding along aloof up in the clouds anyway. Luckily I manifested a sense of self based on purely my values and therefore I am who I feel I need to be to hopefully make it through this life as a 5w4. I hope people realize that alcohol/sexcapades/drugs don’t give any semblence. They are merely parts of life humans tend to exploit for a sense of difference. People like us are different enough as it is lol. I percieve this self destructive route as a tangible tantrum toward life. ~Hence why young ppl trying to navigate life start off & make a sort of hobby out of it.

    • M says

      Hi there. Trauma does that to people. Well, at least me. I rarely have sexual impulses and rarely orgasm. But when I was in my alcohol addiction and able to be in my body, I had a bunch of sex as a way to understand connection. Both being a 5, having a religious background and having trauma.

    • Felix says

      When I first came across the MBTI based tests, I often tested as either INFJ, INTJ or INTP. After doing some research I came to the conclusion that I am an INFJ. My biggest challenge was on determining whether I was a Feeling or Thinking type. The fact that I always need to plan and have a framework within which to work to have a sense of direction helped me understand that I am definitely a J. What used to confuse me is the fact that my career interests seems to be quite different from typical infj. From childhood I have been interested in the STEM much more than any other field. I am far from being an artist but I do appreciate art. I find humanities interesting but not as something I can dedicate my life to. I am not a musician in anyway but do experience music deeper. I am not interested in the languages. In high school I used to score my lowest marks in English. My best subjects where Chemistry, Physics and Mathematics. I even had won awards in Chemistry and Mathematics. My intuition in these subjects was superb. I used to call it thinking without thinking. I used to find it hard to study Geography and History usually ending up sleeping in the process. I was however very much interested in physical Geography. Human Geography was my nightmare. I am an Engineer by profession. I cannot think of a better profession for myself.

      I am very empathetic. I readily help others in need. I usually avoid conflicts. I only react when I am pushed to the end. I value human beings for who they are. However, I generally avoid spending too much time dealing with human issues. Honestly they wear me out and leaves little energy for me to pursue areas of my interest. It is for this same reason why I avoid conflicts. I don’t have friends just a few acquaintances. I generally have no need to establish close friendship. I am one person who is capable of spending a full week without physical contact with people.

      All in all what I am trying to say here is that I know that I am definitely INFJ, enneagram 5W4. These personalities are a continuum and not two people with the same MBTI personality are exactly the same. It appears that for some INFJ there is a preference to skip the auxiliary function and instead use the tertiary function in the personality stacks as the Co pilot. I am not sure of the factors that causes these differences. it could even be upbringing. I must say that my sense of belonging to the INFJ was deepened when I read somewhere that Niels Bohr was INFJ.

  14. Creo says

    Thank you for this article. I have just taken the Enneagram test and came up as a 5w4 and so I’m here now learning about it. This article is perfect because I am also an INFJ. This was sooo helpful! I can relate to alot of what you said in the last few paragraphs too and made me feel hopeful in a way. I will be returning to this website again for sure. Thanks and keep on doing what you’re doing :) <3

  15. gg says

    I’m an intp but 5w4 and found this very interesting. Ive always resonated with the intp type but was confused as it always pointed towards the sciences, which i was fine at, got Bs, but since being a child have always been more interested in the arts. im now studying English literature which is great as it allows me to be analytical but still creative. the 4 wing explains this – being a t, i still base decisions on thought rather than feeling and tbh im terrible at expressing my feelings, but i have a deep appreciation for philosophy, social sciences, art of all kinds (visual, performance, music, poetry) as i admire the wordplay/symbolism etc. anyway soz for my ramble!

    • shana says

      I’m INTP 5w4 as well and that is so true of me. I’m interested in both Mathematics and the Arts. I was even obsessed with classical music during my childhood. Currently, I just graduated from college and planning to take up law. A lot of people say I have a crazy volume of interest. Other INTPs I know would rather focus in one field.

  16. orangegreen says

    Hey, I just wanted to say thank you, an INFJ 5w4 here and on the path to learning more. I have kinda become science oriented and did a lot programming and ict and physics and am now doing selling computer and especially gaming components and doing logistics, and it has been a nice ride along the business and “everyday” world! ;) Although I feel a constant pull towards organizations and leading, perhaps, you know – people – I also feel like terribly drawn to the more mystical side of the world. I would really love to write, when I’ll have enough experience to write from, in my own quiet corner of the world, and also a slight pull to become academically spiritual (read = a monk), or, a creature of the cyberpunk underworld! We’ll see. :) <3

  17. Tipsy says

    Oh God, I totally relate. I could have written this article. I’m INFJ 5w4 as well, I experience it in the same way you explained it. I even dissociate when stressed. And I also studied code and work currently in Digital Arts & Media (actually it looks like a pattern for 5w4s). I’m into science, arts, and paranormal and occult stuff as well. I don’t think I’m an HSP though, at least I hope not.

  18. Briony says

    Hi! This was a really fantastic, and as a fellow 5w4 infj, I really related with almost everything you mentioned. Thank you

  19. says

    Aw, this was an incredibly nice post. Spending some time
    and actual effort to produce a really good article… but what can I say… I hesitate a
    whole lot and never seem to get nearly anything done.

  20. Yolanda says

    I think you are an INTP.
    I am definitely a 5w4 and I used to think I was an INFJ but the profile descriptions don’t fit.
    Have you heard of Socionics? According to that theory the opposite of the second function is as strong as the first one. Ti – Ni combination.

  21. Ace M. says

    I really like your post. I am also type 5 wing 4. I have experienced being unhealthy 5w4 but I surpassed the challenges of being unhealthy. I became an alcoholic and had sexcapades with men. Though some of them offered me relationship, I did not take it. I didn’t like the idea of being in a relationship at that time because I thought that would destroy my privacy. Now, I already recovered and became a normal 5w4. I’m still afraid to be in a relationship but it doesn’t hinder me to connect with others.

  22. Lisa says

    Woah. I am also an INFJ, 5w4, and a HSP. Each one of these things, taken individually, can make one feel isolated and different from everyone else (in both positive and negative ways), but taken all together sometimes makes me feel like I must be completely alone in the world.

    I’m really happy to have learned today that I’m not.

  23. MM says

    I’m also an INFJ 5w4. I think it’s “safer” in T, which is why I’m a 5 versus full 4. But, when I really get into my emotions (which is rare), the heavy 4 wing appears. Thanks for posting.

  24. Kris says

    Really enjoyed this! Can relate a lot and always comforting to know someone is similar to me!
    I am an INFJ and have quite a few friends who are as well, however I’ve noticed we are still very different from one another. Enter enneagram and I am the only one of us that tested 5w4. Makes a lot of senses…and I liked how you described the relation between MBTI and the enneagram! Thanks for your post!

    • says

      So glad to find other 5w4’s!
      I’m actually an ENFP, which makes the combination very rare and uncommon… hehe.
      As a good ENFP I’d love meeting you all! :)
      This is my facebook, in case you want to reach out and chat along… https://www.facebook.com/lmsamperio5
      Please, I’d love to. I always find it quite enlightening to learn from people similar to me.
      Glad to have read this post. Hope to talk to you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

      • Justin says

        I used to think I was an ENFP, but INFJ makes more sense. You should check out the functions and make sure you aren’t in the same situation. :p INFJs are still dominantly perceptive. Now that I think about it, Enneagram was what had me second guessing my state as an ENFP. I misunderstood my Fe as Ne, and my Ni as Fi. Another good way to think of it is that Ni is subjective, whereas Ne is objective.

        To OP: I feel like I’ve “tinkered” with MBTI and cognitive functions for years in my head, trying to understand it properly (not as we understand it now, but as it truly is).

  25. says

    Okay, I was convinced I was a 4W5 until I read this, now I’m confused. I’m an INFJ, and a lot of this describes me. I’ve had people who have watched the biographical movie about Georgia O’Keefe and tell me my personality seems to be as she was portrayed. I’ve got to consider this….because there is a LOT about 4s I really get…but I do focus on IDEAS a lot. Thank you.

  26. Rochelle says

    Interesting..I test INTJ every time I take the Myers Briggs test, usually with a 99% introversion. Sometimes I don’t feel like I relate to the other INTJs I meet because they seem so good at math and science, whereas I tend to excel in the humanities, art, and music. I definitely approach these subjects in a scientific state of mind however.

    When I took the Enneagram test, the results were 5w4. The description is eerily accurate to my own personality, much more so than Myers Briggs. I also relate to some of the negative and unhealthy aspects you listed which frightens me a bit. Sometimes I feel like an alien or worse, some type of outsider doomed to live, forever, on the peripheral of society. Or that I’m watching from the sidelines, while other people enjoy and succeed in life and never taking part.

    I’m an extreme solitary person and tend to isolate and withdraw from people as a coping mechanism. I do have a penchant for melancholy and sometimes macabre things. It’s nice to know that there are other people out there who feel the same. I know logically I should feel so completely alienated and yet I just am.

    • Alex says

      Thanks for sharing Rochelle! We should never forget that MBTI and Enneagram basically are just systems created for people to understand themselves and others easier. Also in being systems created by man they are limited, and every person is unique so it can never describe someone to complete accuracy. I think there will always be people that are more a blend of types and subtypes, the world is full of diversity. From what you told me we seem quite similar. I would suspect I am more of an INTJ if it was not for that I test 90-100% score on emotional intelligence tests. It seems like this area is very highly evolved for me, more so then other skills and it doesn’t correlate that much with the INTJ model.

      I think it is important in life to give up all expectations, since it is expectations that prevent us from living life to the fullest. It was often the reason for my own isolation when I was younger. Many people are obsessed in figuring out the meaning of life. People fail to see that the whole point of it all is to just live it, nothing else. Many people are afraid and won’t take any risks. Life itself is a risk, and there is no security in isolation, that is just part of the illusion. I found great comfort in how quantum physics can explain all of this and give life meaning and mystery. As an INTJ maybe that would be interesting for you, check this out:


      • Priscilla says

        Thank you, Rochelle, and Thank you, Alex. I am an INFP 5w4 (which some folks say is “impossible”–but that’s okay). Somewhere I read that the 5 type is the type that spends the most time with things like the enneagram and MBTI. And, that’s okay, too. Anything to excess can be a problem, but if one can lean in and enjoy the light in exploring personality/personalities it can be a form of Art.

        I come from a family of scientists and I am not scientific, nor mathematical. I am extremely introverted (self-preservation all the way) but not at all shy. Weirdly in my retirement from academia, I am enjoying substitute teaching young children-through-high-school. Half-days. I love connecting with people in intentional settings.

    • says

      So glad to find other 5w4’s!
      I’m actually an ENFP, which makes the combination very rare and uncommon… hehe.
      As a good ENFP I’d love meeting you all! :)
      This is my facebook, in case you want to reach out and chat along… https://www.facebook.com/lmsamperio5
      Please, I’d love to. I always find it quite enlightening to learn from people similar to me.
      Glad to have read this post. Hope to talk to you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

  27. Sam Savage says

    I am really glad I ran across this today. My best friend was most definitely an INFJ. I never really understood why certain things sent her over the edge so easily as I have always been able to reconcile my emotions, albeit sometimes after a brief panic, rather easily. I am an INFP but also one of the highly sensitive types with extreme right brain process. I am a feeler, but my friend’s feelings always took on a life of their own. It was as if she had a dark twin that haunted her regardless of her ability to be rational about an upsetting situation and having received numerous, encouraging talks from those who loved her. As an INFJ, she absorbed so much of the painful energy from others and life in general. Because of her genuine and sincere concern for others it was inevitable that her load was heavier than most. and I always knew that we were so similar in our capacity to love and understand other people, but she always took it one step further than me. She would obsess over an issue on another C half and become very worried and upset if they did not comply with what she thought was best for them. Trust me, I went through that many times with her during the course of our friendship. We lived life good and hard when we were together and I don’t regret one moment of our wild and carefree days. While I had some self destructive behavior, she always kept the level head. I was the one, according to all of our friends, most likely to get into trouble. Tam was always a drinker. Slow and steady. Eventually her anxiety had to be managed with medication, and , when combined with the round the clock drinking, her life became unmanageable. She wouldn’t seek employment opportunities after she was laid off of a job where she worked from her home office. By the end of 2012 she was house bound and out her mind during the day. She was trying to ween herself off of some medications and it was becoming so disheartening for her to fathom having any peace in her heart and mind. On, Saturday December 8, 2012, she ended her life when her husband went out to pick up lunch and cool off from a fight. I don’t think it was a planned suicide but when a woman puts a gun in her mouth, she means business. I have never written about her until now. Understanding her INFJ type has helped somewhat for me to reconcile some of my grief. Should I not have known when I spoke with her the day before? We had plans to see each other the following Monday then I got the phone call from her sweet mother telling me she was gone. She was an INFJ without a doubt and I know now how to support those with this type. It’s good to have an outlet as I miss her very much today…Thank you for letting me share…

    • Alex says

      Thanks Sam, I’m very sorry for your loss. I think for many people life can get the best of us and somewhere along the road some lose track of what is important. I have close friends who been in similar situations and I have myself struggled and been on medications. From my own experiences I’m convinced that alcohol, drugs and medications makes it worse and much more difficult to ever get your life back on track. It molds you into someone you where not from the beginning and it’s hard to find yourself again. Finding faith in something that brings you peace in life is most important, but this is also the hardest part. Some find it in their work, others religion and some people in the love they have for each other. Some don’t. We are all unique and we are all the result of our collected experiences in life, which in part we have no control over. Some people we can help, others we simply can’t. My personal view is that life does not end at death. Why would it, death is a natural part of everything in the universe. It is ever changing all the time, nothing stays the same. I think this would not be the case if there was not a reason, I find comfort in this. Your friend lives on in you and in all the good things she did during her life.

  28. Matt says

    I am an INTJ Enneagram 5w4 and I operate much the same way. Breaking things down and putting them back together again was one of my all time favorite things to do. I still do it from time to time and bring out my inner child. Throughout school I ended up being a straight A student, but the overall simplicity was lacking in challenge and brought me a disturbed view of educational standards. With that in mind, I started getting a perfectionist attitude, which was funny because I knew that nobody is perfect. An imperfect perfection is a hypocritical oxymoron based on false dichotomy. Once I moved and lost practically all of my face-to-face friends after graduating high school, this neuroticism stays with me to this very day. I am an unhealthy 5w4, but I feel that I’m hindering myself from getting anywhere because I’m constantly in my mind thinking about my negative attitude. As of now it is really hard for me to associate with anyone due to the hypersensitive intrinsic nature of this beautiful sub-type. So I’ve been at a loss for quite some time. That and trying to figure out what I want to do in life is hard to figure out. People say just go out there and do stuff until you find something that feels right. But to me, that’s not cautious enough and can get you into deep trouble. So, I’m just trying to make ends meet as of now.

    • Alex says

      Hey Matt, thanks for sharing! I feel I hinder myself on a daily basis in many situations just by being such a perfectionist, I am truly my own worst enemy. I am often surprised when people give me compliments for my work or similar, because in most cases it did not reach up to my own ideals. When under stress it can go so far that I create scenarios in my mind that most likely will not happen but by being such a perfectionist I have to include them in the equation. This often result in me missing out on things and especially when it comes to socializing and forming relationships. When it comes to figuring out what you want to do in life I think most people make it harder then it is. You should not make a point of figuring out what you want to do, obviously there must be things you enjoy doing so stick to those. So many people seem to think the point of it all is to play the game, with the game I mean get an education, get a job, find a partner, buy a house, get married, get kids etc. Chase social status, material wealth and money in an endless cycle that will leave you no more happier then you already are. That is an illusion, just take life as it comes and do what you enjoy doing, it will all work out in time. Being cautious can be good but life is a risk no matter how cautious you are, it comes with the territory. Let that go and it will be easier.

    • says

      So glad to find other 5w4’s!
      I’m actually an ENFP, which makes the combination very rare and uncommon… hehe.
      As a good ENFP I’d love meeting you all! :)
      This is my facebook, in case you want to reach out and chat along… https://www.facebook.com/lmsamperio5
      Please, I’d love to. I always find it quite enlightening to learn from people similar to me.
      Glad to have read this post. Hope to talk to you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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  30. Jesper says

    Here’s what I got and I’ve always been told that I’m a bit atypical…

    Your Cognitive Functions:
    Introverted Intuition (Ni) ||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 12.945
    Extroverted Feeling (Fe) |||||||||||||||||||||||| 11.38
    Introverted Feeling (Fi) |||||||||||||| 6.08
    Extroverted Intuition (Ne) ||||||||||| 4.935
    Extroverted Thinking (Te) |||||| 2.39
    Introverted Thinking (Ti) ||||| 1.99
    Introverted Sensation (Si) |||| 1.47
    Extroverted Sensation (Se) || -1.43

    Your Introverted Intuition (Ni) is very developed.
    Your Extroverted Feeling (Fe) is very developed.
    Your Extroverted Intuition (Ne) is moderate.
    Your Introverted Sensation (Si) is moderate.
    Your Introverted Thinking (Ti) is moderate.
    Your Extroverted Thinking (Te) is moderate.
    Your Introverted Feeling (Fi) is moderate.
    Your Extroverted Sensation (Se) is low.

    • Jesper says

      Is my Si score really “moderate”? It seems low to me, when it comes to hunger, thirst, hygiene and sleeping patterns I am totally lost and my memory is entierly reliant on external activation.

      • Alex says

        Hey Jesper,
        That’s cool you have very similar results as me. I think it only says moderate because of the ratio of the whole, it’s quite low. I’m same as you, can’t feel my limits when it comes to eating and drinking. Hygiene I always cared about though and sleeping patterns I’ve rewired the last 5 years. I used to run on 6 hours sleep a day and be a complete night owl. Now days I’m up with the sun and feel better then ever.

        • Jesper says

          Yes, that sounds reasonable but bad through a systems perspective. I don’t see the benefit of making the “ratio values” subjective to the ratios within each specific test being taken…

          a low functioning thing is always low functioning no matter how well the thing next to it works, no?

          • Jesper says

            Oh. I forgot to mention that my issues with hygiene are pretty much non-existent since two years back or so.

            Sleep, hunger, excretion and many other physical matters are still more or less dysfunctional, though.

          • Alex says

            Yeah I have had to resort to make strict habits and diet/exercise plans to make me handle it better. Still it is not an easy thing, I just spent half a year working some stressful projects and ended up losing 5kg weight without really feeling like I changed my diet in anyway. I think I’m just completely unaware of how my body feels sometimes.

          • Alex says

            I agree, but I think since personality traits and these types of things vary a great deal between people and are still a pretty theoretical model, these issues exist.

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    • kevin says

      Same here… i was wondering why as an INFJ, i didn’t fully resonate with other INFJ’s despite it ringing fairly close to the note compared to other MBTI types . Once i discovered i was 5W4 it makes perfect sense, the missing piece of the puzzle of which is me. The next question is why we ended up as INFJ’s 5W4 rather than the more typical 4W5 INFJ.


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